THE FORUMS
Thanks man!
Therapy can be really good, but the problem is when they want to prescribe pharmaceutical drugs to someone who could be fully fully fully fixed with the methods I've mentioned.
But yeah having someone to talk through your issues with is good.
Tyler
Therapy can be really good, but the problem is when they want to prescribe pharmaceutical drugs to someone who could be fully fully fully fixed with the methods I've mentioned.
But yeah having someone to talk through your issues with is good.
Tyler
__________________
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I started reading on this stuff recently and would love if someone could correct me but from what I know so far, a lot of us (probably most of us) have come into this community as chodes, fully deprived, bad upbringings and massive psychological issues. The experiences we had as kids shaped the our brains, the thoughts we have, the way we see ourselves and who we ultimately ended up becoming before joining this community.
However what were trying to do here is reprogramme ourselves by going through new experiences (references) that show the opposite and that would lead us to be the way we would have been hadn't we had such messed up upbringings / childhood experiences. That we are enough, worthy, lovable etc. That lead to a change in our thoughts, perceptions, the way we view the world and our self-image. And that what happened to us growing up wasnt our fault. How a lot of our addictions or behaviours are manifestations of underlying psychological issues.
"If you havn't grown up with the entitlement that girls can like you just for you, go out and get it" - Tyler (Paraphrasing).
A lot of people talk about parenting, families and sorting out your early childhood trauma/abandonment/abuse. Its something I really want to look into and will have to sort out at one time in my life. I went councelling for a month at university so that I could use it as an excuse to get an extension for my exams but oddly enough I actually found it quite eye opening in the sense that it showed me how much emontional baggage I had underneath. Funny how despite this I can still kill it on a night out but when I get in there with a girl these underlying insecuirties and emotions come to surface. I agree with you about adressing the roots and not the symptoms.
On a side note Gabor Mate is a genius and his books are amazing. Reading In The Realm of Hungry Ghosts now. Something I'd recommend for everyone to read.
However what were trying to do here is reprogramme ourselves by going through new experiences (references) that show the opposite and that would lead us to be the way we would have been hadn't we had such messed up upbringings / childhood experiences. That we are enough, worthy, lovable etc. That lead to a change in our thoughts, perceptions, the way we view the world and our self-image. And that what happened to us growing up wasnt our fault. How a lot of our addictions or behaviours are manifestations of underlying psychological issues.
"If you havn't grown up with the entitlement that girls can like you just for you, go out and get it" - Tyler (Paraphrasing).
A lot of people talk about parenting, families and sorting out your early childhood trauma/abandonment/abuse. Its something I really want to look into and will have to sort out at one time in my life. I went councelling for a month at university so that I could use it as an excuse to get an extension for my exams but oddly enough I actually found it quite eye opening in the sense that it showed me how much emontional baggage I had underneath. Funny how despite this I can still kill it on a night out but when I get in there with a girl these underlying insecuirties and emotions come to surface. I agree with you about adressing the roots and not the symptoms.
On a side note Gabor Mate is a genius and his books are amazing. Reading In The Realm of Hungry Ghosts now. Something I'd recommend for everyone to read.
__________________
Some people need pharmaceuticals.
Not as many people as who are prescribed them, but some people do.
It is an error to assume that everyone can be fixed without them.
It's like those anti-prescription drug websites where they talk about some mineral or whatever that cures bipolar and AIDS and causes world peace or whatever (usually followed by them trying to sell it to you... of course, the big pharmaceutical companies want it BANNED because they can't patent it and therefore can't make money off it it. THE CONSPIRACY!!!).
If you think it may benefit you, go see someone. If they want you to take some meds, research them. Get a second opinion. Nothing says you have to take what the first person suggests. Some meds are good, some are bad, and everything has a different effect on each person based on their own individual chemistry.
Provided you don't have any showstopping issues, like hearing voices, or seeing aliens, or hallucinations, I mean.
Look, if you're a little depressed, bored, unmotivated, but you generally get through your day ok, that can probably be helped with meditation, exercise, some healthy diet, and getting out and doing stuff.
If you're spending the day rocking back and forth in a dark room, you have newspaper clippings taped to your wall with random letters circled because you are deciphering the hidden message put there by the secret power that is running the world, and you have conversations with aliens who materialize every 4th hour, then you may need some help from medication. Except you won't believe this because I'm not one of your alien friends. Or am I?
Not as many people as who are prescribed them, but some people do.
It is an error to assume that everyone can be fixed without them.
It's like those anti-prescription drug websites where they talk about some mineral or whatever that cures bipolar and AIDS and causes world peace or whatever (usually followed by them trying to sell it to you... of course, the big pharmaceutical companies want it BANNED because they can't patent it and therefore can't make money off it it. THE CONSPIRACY!!!).
If you think it may benefit you, go see someone. If they want you to take some meds, research them. Get a second opinion. Nothing says you have to take what the first person suggests. Some meds are good, some are bad, and everything has a different effect on each person based on their own individual chemistry.
Provided you don't have any showstopping issues, like hearing voices, or seeing aliens, or hallucinations, I mean.
Look, if you're a little depressed, bored, unmotivated, but you generally get through your day ok, that can probably be helped with meditation, exercise, some healthy diet, and getting out and doing stuff.
If you're spending the day rocking back and forth in a dark room, you have newspaper clippings taped to your wall with random letters circled because you are deciphering the hidden message put there by the secret power that is running the world, and you have conversations with aliens who materialize every 4th hour, then you may need some help from medication. Except you won't believe this because I'm not one of your alien friends. Or am I?
Okay, so this is something I've been wanting to just mention for a while and I have talked about this, in person, with plenty of guys on this forum.
I, personally, didn't find pickup, until kind of I got out of my "crazy, hardcore newb, suicidial shit". I would say, I'm pretty fucking "normal" at this point- just in the sense that I have a pretty healthy outlook on life and myself and my relation to other people (doesn't mean it's OPTIMAL... but, at this point, it's healthy).
I did CONSISTENT therapy, once a week, every week, for three years. Since then, I have continued to do CONSISTENT therapy, once every two weeks, for the past 1.5 years.
What tyler said is VERY important- Find a therapist who is VERY VERY conservative with prescribing drugs to his/her patients (But if you truly NEED them... then fucking don't be a retard and seriously... just take your damn meds!). Part of the reason, I suck meditation's dick so hard, all the time, is because it basically took the place of and made iirelevent, any sort of "prescribed medicine"
My therapist has been a practicing buddhist for 30 years and is VERY VERY present. Tolle actually talks about the importance of finding a therapist who is "present", if that is a rout you are looking to take.
Basically- my therapist introduced me to meditation when I first started with him, as an alternative to medicine and it saved my life. When you have that kind of experience, with anything, you tend to defend it to the bitter end. It probably isn't for EVERYONE... but for certain people, it is literally the PERFECT thing.
That being said, there are so many cases of people who do therapy and don't see any improvements, so the following are my suggestions for how YOU can take responsibility for your own therapy and MAKE it work, for you:
1. Find a therapist who you geninely like, can trust and connect with. This may be THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of any successful therapy practice. You HAVE to find someone that you can trust, connect with and enjoy being around. A good therapist will be non-judgmental, will allow you the TIME to come to your own conclusions and won't "Push" you in any one direction.
2. BE CONSISTENT- Holy shit, this is also one of the most important aspects of any therapy practice. Don't quit. Don't go one week, then skip like a month and then go back.... Just consistently go, every week, every two weeks, once a month- wtvr it is... JUST GO CONSISTENTLY and within the schedule that you have defined with your therapist.
3. Take responsibility for your therapy practice. Don't just go to your one hour a week and then leave and never think about it again. Make your 100% BEST EFFORT to always be taking a critical eye to yourself and examining your motives, thoughts,actions and whether or not you are making an HONEST effort to APPLY what you are learning.
4. Understand that it WILL get worse before it gets better. That is simply the nature of therapy. It's similar to cleaning out your closet. At first, your room may actually look really messy because you've taken everything out of your closet and you're like, "Well fuck, at least BEFORE trying to clean this thing out, the REST of my room was clean..." But then, over time, you begin to sort through all the shit, throw some of it out and then organize the rest of what's left and you put it back, neatly and organized and in the right way and your room is clean again and then, at a certain point, your closet is completely organized and everything looks a lot better than it did before. BUT- don't get caught up in that period where everything looks WORSE than it did before... just push through and TRUST that it will get better.... You're going to uncover a lot of shit you didn't even know was there, or DID know was there but have been ACTIVELY hiding from.
Those are some of the major points that I think have allowed me to have such a successful therapy practice. There are countless "Failure" stories with therapy, but this is coming from one of the "Success" stories of therapy.
I have to admit- A lot of it has to do with my therapist... He's INCREDIBLE... He's been doing therapy for almost TWENTY FIVE YEARS.... lmfao- think about that.... TWENTY FIVE YEARS....
He's actually writing a book and one of the sections is entirely about my story from completely breaking down to my eventual breakthrough...
I basically went from a period of time of contemplating suicide to where I am now... And anyone who has met me from this forum can probably attest to how much i DON'T want to committ suicide anymore, lmfao.
Anyway- I hope that this helps anyone who is seriously interested in starting up therapy. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.
This is something I feel very strongly about and have been relatively successful with, and at this point, have actually been doing for quite a while (close to 5 years now). So this is just advise from my own experience. Hope it helps : )
I, personally, didn't find pickup, until kind of I got out of my "crazy, hardcore newb, suicidial shit". I would say, I'm pretty fucking "normal" at this point- just in the sense that I have a pretty healthy outlook on life and myself and my relation to other people (doesn't mean it's OPTIMAL... but, at this point, it's healthy).
I did CONSISTENT therapy, once a week, every week, for three years. Since then, I have continued to do CONSISTENT therapy, once every two weeks, for the past 1.5 years.
What tyler said is VERY important- Find a therapist who is VERY VERY conservative with prescribing drugs to his/her patients (But if you truly NEED them... then fucking don't be a retard and seriously... just take your damn meds!). Part of the reason, I suck meditation's dick so hard, all the time, is because it basically took the place of and made iirelevent, any sort of "prescribed medicine"
My therapist has been a practicing buddhist for 30 years and is VERY VERY present. Tolle actually talks about the importance of finding a therapist who is "present", if that is a rout you are looking to take.
Basically- my therapist introduced me to meditation when I first started with him, as an alternative to medicine and it saved my life. When you have that kind of experience, with anything, you tend to defend it to the bitter end. It probably isn't for EVERYONE... but for certain people, it is literally the PERFECT thing.
That being said, there are so many cases of people who do therapy and don't see any improvements, so the following are my suggestions for how YOU can take responsibility for your own therapy and MAKE it work, for you:
1. Find a therapist who you geninely like, can trust and connect with. This may be THE MOST IMPORTANT aspect of any successful therapy practice. You HAVE to find someone that you can trust, connect with and enjoy being around. A good therapist will be non-judgmental, will allow you the TIME to come to your own conclusions and won't "Push" you in any one direction.
2. BE CONSISTENT- Holy shit, this is also one of the most important aspects of any therapy practice. Don't quit. Don't go one week, then skip like a month and then go back.... Just consistently go, every week, every two weeks, once a month- wtvr it is... JUST GO CONSISTENTLY and within the schedule that you have defined with your therapist.
3. Take responsibility for your therapy practice. Don't just go to your one hour a week and then leave and never think about it again. Make your 100% BEST EFFORT to always be taking a critical eye to yourself and examining your motives, thoughts,actions and whether or not you are making an HONEST effort to APPLY what you are learning.
4. Understand that it WILL get worse before it gets better. That is simply the nature of therapy. It's similar to cleaning out your closet. At first, your room may actually look really messy because you've taken everything out of your closet and you're like, "Well fuck, at least BEFORE trying to clean this thing out, the REST of my room was clean..." But then, over time, you begin to sort through all the shit, throw some of it out and then organize the rest of what's left and you put it back, neatly and organized and in the right way and your room is clean again and then, at a certain point, your closet is completely organized and everything looks a lot better than it did before. BUT- don't get caught up in that period where everything looks WORSE than it did before... just push through and TRUST that it will get better.... You're going to uncover a lot of shit you didn't even know was there, or DID know was there but have been ACTIVELY hiding from.
Those are some of the major points that I think have allowed me to have such a successful therapy practice. There are countless "Failure" stories with therapy, but this is coming from one of the "Success" stories of therapy.
I have to admit- A lot of it has to do with my therapist... He's INCREDIBLE... He's been doing therapy for almost TWENTY FIVE YEARS.... lmfao- think about that.... TWENTY FIVE YEARS....
He's actually writing a book and one of the sections is entirely about my story from completely breaking down to my eventual breakthrough...
I basically went from a period of time of contemplating suicide to where I am now... And anyone who has met me from this forum can probably attest to how much i DON'T want to committ suicide anymore, lmfao.
Anyway- I hope that this helps anyone who is seriously interested in starting up therapy. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.
This is something I feel very strongly about and have been relatively successful with, and at this point, have actually been doing for quite a while (close to 5 years now). So this is just advise from my own experience. Hope it helps : )
__________________
90 Days Challenge (Currently in the Final Third): "It's Just Something You Have To Do If You Want To Be Great"
http://www.rsdnation.com/node/233192/forum
The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars
A man may fall down many times, but he won't be a f ailure until he says someone pushed him"
Buddha
http://www.rsdnation.com/node/233192/forum
The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved, desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn, like fabulous yellow roman candles exploding like spiders across the stars
A man may fall down many times, but he won't be a f ailure until he says someone pushed him"
Buddha
Man...PUA is not a cure for stuff like depression.
But neither are drugs IMO.
The stuff Buddhagames is talking about kinda sounds right on to me, based on talking to him in person which is what he's saying over here as well.
A lot of this kinda stuff is what a therapist is useful for.
Like for real, sometimes you need someone to "dump your emotional baggage on" (for lack of a better way of saying it). If you keep doing this with friends...eventually you're really "taking" too much value and for the most part if they're "well adjusted" they'll eventually get tired of it. A therapist can be good for this. Friends can, as well. But if you don't have a super solid support network, and your family and parents aren't good at listening, you're fucked.
In which case, you go to a therapist. That's what I think and that's why I'm trying out this route for a little while.
Game is for picking up chicks, but if you're not emotionally solid, your results won't be what they otherwise could be. I believe if you're not emotionally solid you will learn game but you'll always have this glass ceiling you hit. To get past that you might need to understand your psychology shit more and see a therapist. Like if you have an "emotional wound" I think many people unknowingly do, that's something you need to address, and typically its a therapist who would help you with this. We have defense mechanisms (which create blindspots) and they're there for a reason. A lot of time when people "remove their blindspots" or "drop the defense mechanism" -- they do shit like...kill themselves or fuck up their lives in other ways.
For example I remember some story of a bodybuilder guy with body dysmorphic disorder, somebody from some shit like Jerry Springer kept calling them n shit, trying to push his buttons to get him on the show, eventually the guy realized "what the jerry springer phone guy was saying was true..." and then just started cutting his wrists immediately. Luckily the dude from the phonecall called 911 and they found him before he died but...
most people have "truths" they don't acknowledge, and there's a REASON for it. Its that "the truth hurts" -- I dunno that most people are going to become suicidal in such cases, but based on my reading of the book "Finding Your Own Northstar" where the author talks about "emotional wounds" and if you do then you need a therapist, she says seemingly normal people (aka stable enough) when they delve into their emotional issues can become suicidal which is why she suggests the therapist/counselor shit.
Of course I read about this 4 years ago...
And well, I banged a ton of chicks, had fun, improved myself as a person and who I think I am...
but now I'm checking out the therapy stuff and realizing a lot of that stuff applies to me.
But neither are drugs IMO.
The stuff Buddhagames is talking about kinda sounds right on to me, based on talking to him in person which is what he's saying over here as well.
A lot of this kinda stuff is what a therapist is useful for.
Like for real, sometimes you need someone to "dump your emotional baggage on" (for lack of a better way of saying it). If you keep doing this with friends...eventually you're really "taking" too much value and for the most part if they're "well adjusted" they'll eventually get tired of it. A therapist can be good for this. Friends can, as well. But if you don't have a super solid support network, and your family and parents aren't good at listening, you're fucked.
In which case, you go to a therapist. That's what I think and that's why I'm trying out this route for a little while.
Game is for picking up chicks, but if you're not emotionally solid, your results won't be what they otherwise could be. I believe if you're not emotionally solid you will learn game but you'll always have this glass ceiling you hit. To get past that you might need to understand your psychology shit more and see a therapist. Like if you have an "emotional wound" I think many people unknowingly do, that's something you need to address, and typically its a therapist who would help you with this. We have defense mechanisms (which create blindspots) and they're there for a reason. A lot of time when people "remove their blindspots" or "drop the defense mechanism" -- they do shit like...kill themselves or fuck up their lives in other ways.
For example I remember some story of a bodybuilder guy with body dysmorphic disorder, somebody from some shit like Jerry Springer kept calling them n shit, trying to push his buttons to get him on the show, eventually the guy realized "what the jerry springer phone guy was saying was true..." and then just started cutting his wrists immediately. Luckily the dude from the phonecall called 911 and they found him before he died but...
most people have "truths" they don't acknowledge, and there's a REASON for it. Its that "the truth hurts" -- I dunno that most people are going to become suicidal in such cases, but based on my reading of the book "Finding Your Own Northstar" where the author talks about "emotional wounds" and if you do then you need a therapist, she says seemingly normal people (aka stable enough) when they delve into their emotional issues can become suicidal which is why she suggests the therapist/counselor shit.
Of course I read about this 4 years ago...
And well, I banged a ton of chicks, had fun, improved myself as a person and who I think I am...
but now I'm checking out the therapy stuff and realizing a lot of that stuff applies to me.
__________________
RSD Misinterpreted: A Series of Posts on Popular RSD Ideas and How I Used to Misunderstand Them
Coming to you every Sunday...
►Part I -- What Tyler means by "Drop the Self-Image Paradigm"
►Part II -- [What Do You Want to Hear About On a Coming Sunday?]
Coming to you every Sunday...
►Part I -- What Tyler means by "Drop the Self-Image Paradigm"
►Part II -- [What Do You Want to Hear About On a Coming Sunday?]
You're wrong.
There is such thing as a "broken person."
Read "Finding Your Own Northstar" and esp the chapter "Soul Shrapnel" -- there's a little test which asks you some questions, basically relating to your emotions in situations and your worldview, to give you some idea of whether or not you might have some "emotional wound" to deal with. Unless you had really good parents or you've dealt with this so far, you likely have some issues to deal with.
There is such thing as a "broken person."
Read "Finding Your Own Northstar" and esp the chapter "Soul Shrapnel" -- there's a little test which asks you some questions, basically relating to your emotions in situations and your worldview, to give you some idea of whether or not you might have some "emotional wound" to deal with. Unless you had really good parents or you've dealt with this so far, you likely have some issues to deal with.
The problem with this is the "being fixed" mentality. There is no such thing. Therapy by a good psychologist can make wonders for your self esteem, and that is what matters. So go for it, imo.
I don't know, it seems that in the US meds are all the rage, then i agree with guys that say find one whose main focus is not in prescribing medication, which there are.
I don't know, it seems that in the US meds are all the rage, then i agree with guys that say find one whose main focus is not in prescribing medication, which there are.
__________________
RSD Misinterpreted: A Series of Posts on Popular RSD Ideas and How I Used to Misunderstand Them
Coming to you every Sunday...
►Part I -- What Tyler means by "Drop the Self-Image Paradigm"
►Part II -- [What Do You Want to Hear About On a Coming Sunday?]
Coming to you every Sunday...
►Part I -- What Tyler means by "Drop the Self-Image Paradigm"
►Part II -- [What Do You Want to Hear About On a Coming Sunday?]
This is maybe a bit over-dramatic:
..and they say therapy should heal that deep stuff.. idk.
..and they say therapy should heal that deep stuff.. idk.
__________________
Hold The Frame.
"Apply what you learn, push your comfort zone and most importantly HAVE A BLAST doing it."
"Just don't ever lose track and forget why you're doing what you're doing. If that happens, then really, what's the point?"
- Pat Flynn
Getting my income and cold approach handled in 2013: 30
"Apply what you learn, push your comfort zone and most importantly HAVE A BLAST doing it."
"Just don't ever lose track and forget why you're doing what you're doing. If that happens, then really, what's the point?"
- Pat Flynn
Getting my income and cold approach handled in 2013: 30
Ive been severely depressed (like couldnt laugh at a fucking joke and felt like crying instead, jeez) a few years ago and fixed it by myself through stress management, good nutrition, exercise and positive reframing of negative experiences BUT it took me a lot of time, which I think could have been quicker with the help of a therapist. For cases like this i think people should never take pharmaceutical drugs but for hard cases of people hearing voices and shit they might have a point.
The amount of drugs prescribed is just insane. in fking sane. You cant blame the doctors because people want that easy pill, and if they dont prescribe it to them and something bad happens lets say they attemp suicide BAMM they get sued.. so theyre like fine you dumbass if you wanna pay for these useless drugs they heres your prescribtion
The amount of drugs prescribed is just insane. in fking sane. You cant blame the doctors because people want that easy pill, and if they dont prescribe it to them and something bad happens lets say they attemp suicide BAMM they get sued.. so theyre like fine you dumbass if you wanna pay for these useless drugs they heres your prescribtion
__________________
My Fitness blog : PwnFitness
As for PUA not being a cure to depression I partially disagree. If youre just a bit depressed but not depressed to the point where people dont wanna talk to you, having a fun night out, pull or not, does wonders.
__________________
My Fitness blog : PwnFitness
The thing with psychiatrists.... they will almost always perscribe you drugs.
Even if they don't know what is wrong with you, they will give you a label anyways, because no doctor wants to admit he/she can't figure something out.
they will put you on a drug and keep tabs on you.
Here is the important thing: If you think it's bullshit and don't take the drugs, then they will put you on a disobedient list. Once you're on this list, every doctor you will see in the future will be able to see it and they will treat you differently. And if some conflict comes up, they will use that against you and say you are a "bad patient".
But if you actually do have some problem, then you should definitely go. It's a gamble, and also why I sort of resent how things in america work sometimes.
Even if they don't know what is wrong with you, they will give you a label anyways, because no doctor wants to admit he/she can't figure something out.
they will put you on a drug and keep tabs on you.
Here is the important thing: If you think it's bullshit and don't take the drugs, then they will put you on a disobedient list. Once you're on this list, every doctor you will see in the future will be able to see it and they will treat you differently. And if some conflict comes up, they will use that against you and say you are a "bad patient".
But if you actually do have some problem, then you should definitely go. It's a gamble, and also why I sort of resent how things in america work sometimes.
__________________
* Anyone in Indiana. Especially Bloomington *
PM me!
PM me!
der
Junior Member
Join Date: 08/09/2012 | Posts: 2
addresed.
For many people, the women-problem is just a symptom of deep psychological problems. More rarely also, there may be something wrong with the
brain hardware itself like serotonin deficiency etc. So, aside from the nutrition/RSD/self help/etc would it be helpful to also consult a
profesional psychologist or at some cases a psychiatrist? I know there are many issues there like what is a "good" psychologist
and what if your self image is more "i am sick now" etc, BUT, as you have already stated, taking information from diverse sources is crucial if you want to accelerate your progress.
It's not evidence but i know friends of mine that battled on their own with their problems and when they decided to visit a psychologist the proccess accelerated masively.
And the factor that i think would further add to my argument, is that oftentimes especially if you are young, you do not even know what the real
problem is and so you don't adddress the roots but the symptoms. And the videos etc sure probably help, but speaking to someone every week for example who also knows your personal story and journey may also help a lot.
What's your take on that? What would you suggest to people reading?
ps: respect man, your insights have REALLY helped me, hope i will pay it back to you one day.