THE FORUMS

January 20th, 2017
Beware of a Create your own Reality philosophy, and my story
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#21

Alexandre

Senior Member

Join Date: 10/04/2009 | Posts: 199

I am interested in this debate, but please, stop talking about God, or any religion.

It is not an argument for neutral people, for people who are reasoning through their minds.

I'm living in Europe and it's a common prejudice that in America people are more religious, they say they're interested in science but they rarely use scientific approach and a great part of american population are stupid. If you're american you may be offended by the word “stupid”, but look, let me quote a survey from National Science Foundation: 90 % of americans say they're interested by the scientific, but only a half know that the Earth orbits the Sun once for every year. It says a lot.

Look, Eckhart Tolle is not a scientist and when he teaches about presence he says to shut up your mind and discover your “profound being”. And listen, I think even Tyler is a believer if he believes in some kind of strange methods like those presented in The Secret because there's no scientific evidence.

Now I'm not saying that this is false and that this pseudo-scientific technique is not working. It probably changes your thoughts process, hopefully for the good because of something like a placebo effect. I'm just saying that there's no scientific evidence of that. No proof. There are still many useful things that we use on the earth without knowing how they work.

But what is sad, is that we can not talk with religious people. They are close-minded and well protected by their own religion from external influence. Nice. If you're religious, you will not be able to agree with me. But I don't expect such a thing from you. Just try to understand me, and understand that I'm trying to understand you, in peace. I have a friend who always refers to Bible whenever he has doubts so he always stays true to his religion. He believes and it gives him a solid ground, he feels secure because his religion seems to him to be something superior, something above him, something that has the ABSOLUTE TRUTH. He relies on religion to take right actions, to have confidence in himself, to reassure himself that he's on the right path.

And this is good. Bible tells a lot of good things. I've read quite a few passages in the Bible. I'm sure if you follow some simple rules from the Bible you'll be a good person.



But look. The problem is that you BELIEVE in J-C, in bible, in God, in Ten Commandments. There's no scientific evidence of that. Think about myths. Bible could be written AND invented by simple humans. If you need to believe in something, maybe you'll find that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is cool.



Now, maybe at some level you need to believe in something. If you try to think about the meaning of life, or it's origin, you'll find it very difficult. Or maybe you'll find some nonsense, but it doesn't make a difference. I do not want to believe in anything. Not even in God (his existence or non-existence), not even in the Now. I tried as hard as I could to find an answer, I failed. I can not approve nor deny the idea of God. I accept my failure and I just remain neutral about this subject.



I just trust my own sense of good / bad, because I was conceived with this sense, I have emotions and I recognise how does it affect me. I have empathy, I feel bad if someone is feeling bad. Look, I'm a normal dude probably just like you and I have everything I need to have a normal life. I also understand that I am vulnerable, that there's some mind conditioning, and that everything in this world may influence my mind, and maybe I am wrong right now.



But I am ready to recognise it at any time and discard what I was thinking. I am ready to listen to you.

If you understand this and trust yourself, life on earth may become very simple.



Now one last thing. The reason why I'm taking a Bootcamp with Alexander~ very soon is because I feel he has a similar way of thinking. Let me quote him:

People fear, trust, have faith in and react to Gods and spirituality in the same way that they fear, trust have faith in and react to their society and the people around them. I Personally believe in evolutionary theory, but always wondered why I had distinct feelings of spirituality that others attributed to religion. I could never reconcile the two. My best guess now is that the spiritual feeling I experienced was my innate awareness of a higher power that isn’t the work of God or deities, but rather my inborn evolved mechanism in my physical brain that serves to pay attention to the social culture around me.
Awareness of society as a higher power helps me to understand that I belong to a bigger force, human society, that I depend on to survive. I, like everyone else, is biologically driven to fit in more and more, to build a strong reality as reinforced and validated by the people around me.
This need for an externally reinforced reality and a desire to fit in is true for most people, but not alpha males and those who have alpha mindsets. Understanding that spiritual feelings and that your awareness of a higher power is just an evolved mechanism in your brain is very important when it comes time to trusting yourself and making your own decisions that go against the way you have been socially conditioned.

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Being human always points, and is directed, to something, or someone, other than oneself — be it a meaning to fulfill or another human being to encounter. The more one forgets himself, by giving himself to a cause to serve or another person to love — the more human he is and the more he actualizes himself. What is called self-actualization is not an attainable aim at all, for the simple reason that the more one would strive for it, te more he would miss it. In other words, self-actualization is possible only as a side-effect of self-transcendence.
— Victor Frankl
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#22
scottsdale

scottsdale

Trusted Member

Join Date: 10/23/2007 | Posts: 1542

ok warvick, I respect you a lot man. I think you are intelligent. Not just smart, but wise enough to act on your own beliefs.

I'm sure you are in a better place now. Or at least getting there. You are probably happy that you have finally hit upon the "answer". But would you seriously have ever gotten where you are at now if it wasn't for what you been through? Isn't gods plan for us here to learn between good and evil and experience joy?

I think  the main plan for our life here on earth (in a christian sense), is to experience Joy. But you cannot experience joy, if you do not know its opposite. Without light there is no dark, Opposition. Law of Polarity. Whatever you wanna call it... You only know what will bring you true happiness, fulfillment, peace and joy because you have experienced what brings you emptiness, pain and a lot of pussy... So are you at least thankful for the journeys that have brought you to where you are at??

Yeah in this community there is a lot of shit. Even I look at peoples attitudes of just "fuck bitches" with some pretty distaste. But dude, they would be like that even if it wasn't for the community. Only differance is now they have the knowledge and system to make it happen... I don't want to disrespect girls, or cause pain. I love girls with intense passion. Nothing has mattered as much to me in life as girls have, on both a physical and emotional sense... But even then, I'm a selfish fucked up piece of shit. I'm full of lust. I want pussy. And I want to experience a lot of it because I'm out of control with my sexual cravings... I see how weak that is... I also see the depth and sense of a more meaningful commited relationship. I used to daydream about having that all growing up, but then what happened? Life happened, society, peers. Its all shit and corrupt. Porn fucked me up. Hollywood might have too. Society in general fed me some shit and I wasn't smart enough to create my own reality and follow my own paths. I've bought into the lures of the "wordly ways". I'm NOT saying I'm not responsible for the life I have led thus far, because I am responsible, for everything.

So in reality you are right in a way. Following this path could be leading straight to an empty, meaningless life. If you let it go there. Which in the majority of the SUCCESSFUL casses, it will go there. Because like me, lots of people lack the courage and wisedom to choose correctly for themselves.

I'm split into two people. One being the pure real me, and the other being the mortal human animal me.... We are alive right now to experience the mortal animal, and ultimately tame it. Control it... Natural man is an enemy to god. But being a natural man is what teaches us... so the test is, after we have learned, will we choose to tame it???

I'm not trying to just rationalize going out and fucking chicks. I'm trying to say, that maybe some of us really need this. And we won't get from point A to point B without this.

I for one have shitty inner-game and beliefs. I really am sick of being so stifled and unconfident. I been this way all growing up. And not only that, but I truly do want success with the kind of women I want and I'm not getting that yet... And selfishly along the way, I do want some beautiful hunnies to rub their shit all over my shit. It just sounds great. Whatever that will bring, I dont really care, because I havent had it, and I want it (with so called HB10's anyhow).

And RSD does offer up some answers to that. But you guys are afraid they dont warn you enough? Or that they throw you blindly into some shit? Since when was it their responsibility to give everyone lessons on morality? Guys come here because they are immoral and want to fuck. RSD is an immoral fuckin company based on their motives alone, of fucking. And I don't see them changing anytime soon based on financial success alone.

RSD gives up a method. It's your responsibility as to what you do with it. And what you allow it to do for you. We really should be taking it all with a grain of salt.

So I see where you are coming from. It's enlightened. And they very well might be the ultimate keys to "the path". I don't really want to be on the "meaningless empty path", who does?... I want core confidence, I want to be happy, And I want great women to be apart of my life... How can we turn this into a wholesome path? Because to me, those can still be wholesome desires... If not spotted with some immorality, whatever the fuck that is. Human, thats what that is.

Maybe RSD needs to drive into a new direction. Or atleast a swell, or movement in the right direction. I don't know the answers to all this. But we should be able to find one. One that makes sense. I would jump onboard.

Lots to think about. ~~~~ and there, my wall of text for this thread, phew.
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#23
EhhWhatsUpDoc

EhhWhatsUpDoc

Member

Join Date: 10/26/2009 | Posts: 90

I don't know which church you belong to, but my point of mentioning KJV was exactly your point. You celebrate Easter, but the Easter Bunny happens to be a non-Christian tradition. The point is, so many churces these days are infiltrated, and the original Bible is altered, that's why even though I believe in Yeshua and God, I do not trust anything the Bible has to say.

There's even a couple of banned books that's not in the Bible that are in print these days. Google them. Are you sure you know the Truth?
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#24

A_Label

Senior Member

Join Date: 02/27/2010 | Posts: 110

 Rofl. Eckharte Tolle, and by extension Ciaran, is an idiot. ET had a nice autohypnotic generative belief change which made him into a state-bearing hippie for a few years, and despite not having any real clue of how he achieved this he now has a large following that will believe any of the bullshit that comes out of his mouth.

Secondly, some of the things (RAS, rapport styles, characterized alpha state) from RSD, and I mean RSD, not the "pickup community", actually contain unique observations which are lacking in NLP's basic structure and theory. Of course, most people aren't going to be able to learn a single useful thing from that information, but that's the way it is with everything. There are people who will never really understand anything and yet still have lots of beliefs.

Third, the "philosophy" of RSD, as incongruent as it is, is merely a cobbling together of James Allen's take on buddhism, Ayn Rand's objectivism, and a bit of taoism and some basic NLP principles, mostly not described well enough to be picked up on unless you're looking for them. It's not really "new age". "New Age" is more like "the universal energy man! It's in my veins!!" *shoots up*. All of the philosophies, sans NLP, in RSD are over 50 years old now, some thousands. And no, they don't make any real suggestions about what to do once you've actually got a girl. You think a relationship with another human being with some 100 billion brain cells and who knows how many synapses with complex evolutionary, social, and emergent behavior can be covered in some mere dating guide? Or some religious text or some idiots on a "romance help" column or TV show or whatever else? Naive, at best.

Finally, a genuine word of caution to those who might be trying to 'force' themselves into 'state'. There are dangers to this, you may damage your relationship with your subconscious mind, you may experience a complete remission back into a chode, you may become stuck in some alternate state of consciousness, or, and this is the worst one, if you manage to fuck with one of your beliefs without providing a replacement that serves all your secondary gains, then you risk breaking your belief and entering a state of catatonia. Read on it. It doesn't sound like fun to me. Trying to mess with your subconscious without knowing NLP is like diving into a pool without knowing that you need to hold your breath. Mind you, the dangers aren't that great statistically (although remission is very likely given the nature of RSD's training- albeit recoverable), but your mental strategies will ultimately determine how you end up rewiring yourself.
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#25
scottsdale

scottsdale

Trusted Member

Join Date: 10/23/2007 | Posts: 1542

One more thing I might add... Regardless to what Religions and Faiths and most societies teach, is it not possible that maybe a Mans desire to have multiple women is correct? 

Maybe the way we generally go about it might be meaningful and empty... But mostly because of what our peers have taught us, It stops us from being with multiple women, and being happy... When in reality I think lots of men really want to be with lots of girls and this might not be such a bad desire... What if it was our destiny, and society has pounded down such a way of life?

This is almost unatainable, and probably hard to imagine because of our limiting beliefs that have been TAUGHT to us... But would you feel empty still if you were in love and with like 20 girls for your whole life and they were all commited to you? sounds pretty nice to me. Something about that possibility speaks to my soul. Maybe its just a fantasy.

But look at nature. Animals express this form of lifestyle. Alpha male who rules and fucks all the women in his herd. He takes care of them too.. And we dont question the validity of it. Their life goes on.


I could be wrong here... But could be something to this.

More rationalizing maybe. tounge

.
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#26

A_Label

Senior Member

Join Date: 02/27/2010 | Posts: 110

 "Rationalizing", for one, is a vast oversimplification of the processes of generalization, distortion and deletion, which can both work to our advantage to create the greatest geniuses of our race, and to trap you as a chode. It is not a one-way-one-outcome process.

Secondly, the idea that "some girl can make you feel a certain way" is a complete fallacy.
The process of "feeling stuff" is one in which you recognize something relevant, and then decide to feel a certain way about it. The decision is not a conscious one, mind you, but very few decisions are. There are no magical electrical wires going from the other person that hack into your brain and force you to feel a certain way, good or bad, it's really all in your head.
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#27
scottsdale

scottsdale

Trusted Member

Join Date: 10/23/2007 | Posts: 1542

Its not necessarily that I believe a girl will make me feel a certain way.

More so that I believe I will feel a certain way if I have a girl.


.
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#28

A_Label

Senior Member

Join Date: 02/27/2010 | Posts: 110

randallpink83 wrote:
Its not necessarily that I believe a girl will make me feel a certain way.

More so that I believe I will feel a certain way if I have a girl.


.
If X, then Y = if Y, then X.
Both of those sentences are semantically synonymous, with only minor syntactic transformation.
You're basically saying that 'having a girl', whatever that may specifically entail for you, is the parameter you require to enter state "happiness", or whatnot.

Would you also say that you have never been happy even without a girl? Not once in your life?
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#29

joe3ll

Member

Join Date: 11/02/2009 | Posts: 38

Warvick:

- I still don't buy that RSD principles are necessarily opposed to religion, monotheistic or otherwise. What exactly does RSD compromise that religion provides? It seems to me, you don't have a problem with RSD -- you have a problem with guys wanting to get better at developing sexual relationships with women, period.

- You write: "Look don't be offended but the Seduction Community IS a religion, you can't prove lots of the core theories within it and however you have dudes hanging on every word that comes out of Tyler's mouth, how do you prove Nimbus is spiritual?" Not true. I view the seduction community as a very much of a take-it-or-leave it field. And that's exactly what it is, considering how profoundly it has evolved over the years. You don't have to follow everything, just what makes sense to you and for you. Guys who come into it, clueless with women, or just not great at developing sexual relationships, need some sense of how to make that part of the lived experienced work better. Usually, they figure out what to say, but not how or why they're saying it. That's where inner-game comes in, and that's all about undoing the social damage that occurred to drive us to the internet to figure this out in the first place. Again, wanting to have sex with women might be something you find evil, but blame the desire, not those providing some framework with how to deal with it. And the proof is literally in the results. The truth becomes your truth because of demonstrable results. Christianity not only presupposes belief, but requires unwavering faith forever, regardless of experience. Christianity says you have to follow the tenets, or else you don't go to Heaven (and maybe, go straight to Hell, depending on what sect you follow -- all of which believe they have the absolute truth and the others are WRONG). With seduction materials, you follow them, and if they don't work, you troubleshoot or move on. You can leave it behind if it isn't relevant to you, the only consequence: If you don't improve with women, you don't improve. On the other hand, if you disobey a vengeful God, (by which I mean the doctrines, written by man, that claim to interpret his will), you risk eternal damnation. Stakes are way different.

- On your intolerance: How do you know that I, a post-modern atheist, am not leading a fulfilling life? You don't. But you have "The Word," which enables you to ignorantly and arrogantly condemn every human that doesn't subscribe to your narrow doctrine. The problem with Christian absolutism is apparent in your and the OP's posts: You've had horrible experiences making sense of your life through, triggered RSD, therefore everyone else will! As an atheist, I don't believe all religious people are idiots -- because I've embraced the horrifyingly relativistic POV that's cool with everyone finding their own peace in their own context. Several types of Christians don't extend that acceptance toward their fellow humans.

- Related: That anyone who doesn't believe in Christ as the Savior hasn't seriously looked into the matter. Again, your arrogance and drive to make serious judgments about other people's lives blinds you. I have researched it extensively. In fact, I've encountered Dr. Craig before, but I'll save my deep criticisms for his arguments, and my profound issues with Christianity's validity and usefulness for another discussion.

- So, for now, back to my original point: Religion, as comforting as it is, does not provide all the answers to the myriad "problems" of free will. How can it? Are you not allowed to desire to change your own life?

Where does God's will end and man's begin?
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#30

Alexandre

Senior Member

Join Date: 10/04/2009 | Posts: 199

warvick,
What you say makes sense and is certainly true.
__________________
Being human always points, and is directed, to something, or someone, other than oneself — be it a meaning to fulfill or another human being to encounter. The more one forgets himself, by giving himself to a cause to serve or another person to love — the more human he is and the more he actualizes himself. What is called self-actualization is not an attainable aim at all, for the simple reason that the more one would strive for it, te more he would miss it. In other words, self-actualization is possible only as a side-effect of self-transcendence.
— Victor Frankl
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