October 26th, 2016
Mastering Communication
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Respected Member

Join Date: 10/03/2008 | Posts: 816

Hey guys. The insights I have about this topic play a HUGE role in my game.. so as a result, this post is going to be very extensive. I hope you can learn something from it.

The problem alot of guys have is they misunderstand the higher purpose of communication.

AFC's think that communication is all about information. An AFC will talk to a girl and he'll actively seek out a subject, and latch on to it. Maybe he'll try to impress her with his knowledge of that subject. Maybe he'll ask her about what SHE knows about the subject. Or worst of all, maybe he'll ARGUE with her about the subject. Yikes!

Most girls will eventually extract themselves from such an interaction, either politely, or rudely. But for those times that a girl doesn't t roll her eyes and extract herself from the conversation, she will pretend to be interested. And naturally, an AFC will talk more about the subject. His thought process is, "Oh she finds this subject interesting... So I'll talk about it more."

In reality, the girl doesn't give a damn about what the AFC is talking about. She's only nodding and smiling to encourage more talking. In reality, she's only thinking about THE GUY TALKING.

Firstly, she's observing his appearance, and thinking "he has nice eyes.." or "he should get a haircut", or "he really knows how to dress". Working on your grooming, your clothing style, and your physique is all you can do, and all you NEED to do, to maximize your appearance.

Secondly, and though this thought process comes secondly, it's really the most important thought-process that goes on in a girl's mind while you're talking to her: she's observing your SUBCOMMUNICATIONS.

What are subcommunications? They're pretty much what they sound like.. Pieces of information about yourself that you communicate through subtext.

In no particular order (they are all equally important), the 3 main methods of subcommunication are:

- Body Language
- Vocal Delivery
- Eye-Contact

Each method of subcommunication would take an entire post to discuss. The simplest path to understanding and mastering subcommunication is confidence, and assuming attraction. I could explain myself to exhaustion for you, but in reality, subcommunication skill comes from having a solid Inner Game.

Now moving up the ladder, we have the rAFC, or the Beginner PUA.

The bPUA understands how important subcommunications are, and consciously emulates attractive ones, to give him an appearance of elevated value.

Great, good job. Girls are more responsive now. But the bPUA now encounters a new obstacle: he's learned all these concepts about attraction building (negs, C+F, Push/Pull). This knowledge is truly a double-edged sword with no handle, in that, until it is learned to be used CORRECTLY, the bPUA will end up only hurting himself.

The problem is, bPUA's experiment with "lines" and "routines" with expectation that they will trigger and generate attraction in a girl. This "expectation" is called "Outcome Dependency", and it negatively affects both subcommunications, and the conversation itself. While the AFC believes communication is about discussing topics and sharing information, the bPUA believes that communication is about creating attraction.

Both the AFC, and bPUA, are wrong. Communication is not about information, or about attraction.

Back to the bPUA, his attraction oriented approach creates an unauthentic, "fake" feel to the conversation. The girl will pick up on it and things won't go smoothly. The biggest mistake a bPUA makes is Incongruency.. this is when the things he says do not match up with the way he presents himself to be.

If you have a guy that's exhibiting really insecure subcommunications, no matter how smooth his material is, it's not going to work. His "game" has to be congruent with his "frame". His Outer Game must match up with his subcommunications.

What it really comes down to is an expression of Value. Your subcommunications are how a girl judges your value. And if the game you spit implies more value than what you're demonstrating to her with your SubC's, then you are going to fail everytime.

Similarly, if your spit game is WEAKER than your SubC's, this incongruency will also lower your perceived Value.

This is why some gurus are always saying "just be yourself". It's not about just accepting who you are and not striving for improvement. It's because, when you just "be yourself", you will naturally be congruent. Your "game" will match your "frame".

Unfortunately, for alot of guys this advice simply means "stay an AFC". That surely doesn't seem to help, does it? It's like saying "Stay how you are! You won't get any better with chicks, but hey, at least you're congruent!"

So, in order to maintain congruency, while improving on the communication abilities of both the AFC and the bPUA, we need to understand what the purpose of communication really is:

To generate emotions.

Why do girls like watching Soap Operas? Because they are EXTREMELY emotional. They're full of suspense and drama, and heartbreak and love. It doesn't matter that the fucking things make no sense at all, or that the extravagency of the plots make it so obvious that the writers are just making it up as they go along. Girl's are willing to IGNORE logical thinking, as long as they get the satisfaction of being taken on an emotional rollercoaster ride.

What's that? Johnny Bedroom came out of his coma and hijacked a Space Shuttle to fly to the moon so he could the bomb that the russians planted there to blow the moon out of orbit and make it crash into Cuba, because the girl he loves just happens to be vacationing in Cuba and he will do anything to protect her? Makes perfect sense! Oh Johnny~! You're so brave and protective and coma-defying, and aeronautically gifted, with a background in bomb-defusion!

Emotions trump logic everytime. If that were an actual show, girls would wet themselves over Johnny.

Now before you get all excited and go around telling girls stories about how you flew to Mars and battled viscious Octopus-Aliens with a baseball bat.. you must understand that logic does have it's place.. There has to be a foundation of believability.. It's just, the more emotional excursions you take a girl on, the less she will focus on logisitics, and the more she will fall into an emotional trance.

First let's start with the basics of emotions and communication. And this holds true with anyone, not just girls.. When you communicate with people, your focus should be on giving them PLEASANT emotions.

I have an uncle who is always talking about things that piss him off. The last time I talked to him, he was telling me about how bad a president Bush is and how the tragedy in Myanmar just makes him think about how poorly Bush helped the victims of Hurricane Katrina.

All I could say to that was "..Yeah.. That's fucked up." It definately was a conversation that I didn't want to be in. Why? Because he was communicating ANGER and FRUSTRATION. Who wants to feel that?

A new waypoint here in understanding is that it's possible to talk about things that make you ANGRY and still create pleasant feelings in the person you're talking with..

The only way I can explain this is by dropping the word "communicate" and replacing it with "elicit". Now what "elicit" means is to "extract" or "bring out". Your new goal in social interaction is to focus on ELICITING EMOTIONS.

Notice this is different from COMMUNICATING emotions.

My Uncle communicated negative emotions. That by itself is perfectly acceptable. But the way he DID it, he was ELICITING negative emotions. The conversation wasn't a discussion, it was just him telling me how horrible Bush is. It was him trying to ELICIT a NEGATIVE EMOTION in me towards Bush. This was my Uncle's way of "vibing", or "emotive bonding" with me.

It makes sense. He was angry. He wanted me to feel angry too. He thinks that would make us friends somehow.

But his social weakness is not understand that people NEVER want to be elicited into feeling NEGATIVE emotions.

It's possible to communicate negative emotions in a way that ELICITS positive emotions.. Talk show hosts do this all the time. They talk about some shit in the current news and they make a joke out of it. They know their role. The people in the audience in the studio, and the people at home watching on tv, they want to feel good. They want to laugh. They want to be elicited to feel positive emotions.

This is the highest level of communication. Eliciting emotions.

There are two ways to elicit emotions:


The strongest ways to elicit emotions is by having either a CONFLICT of Communication and SubC's (You say one thing but clearly demonstrate feeling something different) or a UNITY of Communication and SubC's (You say one thing and clearly demonstrate feeling it).

The CONFLICT method is used to trigger curiousity and feelings of SYMPATHY, EMPATHY, or INTIMACY.

Once, I gamed a girl by playing the Sadness card. I used all my SubC's to convey that I was extremely sad and depressed. She responded by trying to cheer me up. I had elicited SYMPATHETIC and EMPATHETIC emotions in her. As she Kino'd me I looked away and pretended like I was "trying" to act happy (pretending to pretend, good lord I made things complicated). I said "no no it's cool.. I'm.. I'm okay .. I feel.. I'm happy... really..". I was CONFLICTING my Communication with my SubC's. She said "no, you're not.. I can tell."

I played this game throughout the night, slowly turning my SubC from SADNESS to PLAYFULNESS the more she Kino'd me and the more she became affectionate. I began laughing now and then saying "You're so cute, you don't need to cheer me up.. I'm.. I'm okay.. really." Then I'd slowly slide back into sad SubC's and she'd try to encourage me some more, I'd respond by smiling and laughing again, and becomming a little more playful and intimate.

I was REWARDING her escalation by eliciting PLEASANT emotions in her everytime she made advances towards the direction I wanted her to go.

By the end of the night we were making passionate love in the backseat of my car. It didn't matter that she had a boyfriend. I had taken her on an emotional journey, and the logical part of her brain ("I shouldn't be doing this, I have a boyfriend") submitted to the emotional part of her brain ("sadness, mystery, confusion, playfulness, intimacy, sexuality").

I chose the response I wanted to elicit (empathy, growing intimacy), and I CONFLICTED my Communication and SubC's to do it.

A UNITY of Communication and SubC's can also elicit very powerful emotions.

I took a girl to a Carnival a few months ago and the main emotion I wanted to elicit was ADVENTURE. To do this I used a UNITY approach, by telling her (Communication) that I was going to create a new name and identity for her, something fun and exciting. Then I had her create one for me, too. Once we had our "roles", (Hers was "girl from the 50's that is astounded by everything and everyone she sees", and mine was "Indiana Jones".. lol).

What happened was I grabbed her hand and ran her around (SubC), pretending to hold on to my Indy-hat and telling her that we had to make it to the other side of the grounds and find the treasure before 10pm.

She played along and had fun laughing and exclaiming "oh my goodness! Where am I?" and shit like that, in her 50's girl role. It all was definately VERY stupid.. but I was eliciting a feeling of ADVENTURE in her. Things were goofy at first but after 10 minutes or so, she was really into it.

Along the way I changed the story and said "okay now we're lovers from warring families, engaging in a secret rendezvous." (communication), to match it, I held her close by the waist kissed her on the nose and forehead alot (SubC) and told her how I didn't care if everyone knew that I loved her, or that it might get me killed. She began playing along with that too. We didn't get to play any more roles because that one led to us making out and leaving the carnival early to fuck.

I chose the response I wanted to elicit (ADVENTURE), and I UNITED my Communication and SubC's to do it.

The important thing to remember in UNITY of elicitations is you do not give her the option of disagreeing. If you think it's stupid, or you think she won't go along with it, then DON'T TRY IT. Because your hesitation will show through in your SubC, and you will accidentally elicit HESITATION emotions into her.

This is why motivational speakers are good at getting crowds excited. Because they identify an emotion they want to elicit, and then they use the UNITY approach.

It doesn't matter who the fuck the people are in the audience. A motivational speaker knows that as long as his Communication is congruent with his SubC, he WILL elicit his intended emotional response.

Now you should realize that, if one guy can elicit a response from an entire AUDIENCE of people, why the fuck can't you elicit an ADVENTURE response from one girl? There's no answer to that, because it's a RHETORICAL question. The answer is: you CAN DO IT. Anyone can do it.

It doesnt' matter who you are.

I know a guy who's really fat, and always has some Television show Tshirt on, like "The Office" or "That 70's Show".. Suffice to say, he's not giving off any "I'm sexy" vibes to girls. But he's very good at the UNITY tactic. He'll tell a girl "You're spanish right? You're totally from mexico or something", when the girl is clearly asian. She'll laugh and disagree, and he'll ignore her and say "Oh my god this fucking rocks. I've always wanted to know a Spanish girl. I love your soap operas and the way your chihuahas can talk." And every time he sees that girl, he'll tell her to do a spanish dance for him, or he'll say something in spanish and act confused when she doesn't understand.

And what happens? That girl throws her arms around him and sits on his lap, and kisses his cheeks and stuff, and even plays along at times. Once I heard him say, when she sat on his lap "Ay caramba!" and I thought "game.. man.. fat boy has game."

So ANYONE can succeed if you get good at eliciting emotions.

Role playing isn't the only way that you can elicit emotions.

Even with UNITY, you can simply say "I am SO HAPPY RIGHT NOW." (Communication) *Smile, grab her hands jump up and down* (SubC) "Jump up and down with me! Be happy! We must celebrate!" and you'll elicit happy emotions in her.

It doesn't matter what the fuck you do. As long as you make her feel good! Even storytelling should be done to make her feel good. Your stories don't need to be complex or even real, just as long as they elicit some positive emotions in her.

My favorite story to tell is about how I went ice-skating and over the night, gained more and more confidence and went faster and faster.. then as I approached a curve at one point.. I couldn't turn! I twisted and leaned but I kept going straight.. straight towards the KIDDIE section that was roped off.. with all the small little kids holding on to their ice-walkers for balance and stuff.. and so I yanked and twisted myself as hard as I could.. and it made me swing around BACKWARDS! Now I was flying backwards towards the kiddie section with no way to stop.. and I ended up crashing through the ropes and flipping over them and all the little kids screamed and scatterred.. and the ice-attendants had to untangle me from the ropes while all around me there were tiny little kids screaming and crying.. I probably traumatized them for life.

And the whole reason I tell that story is not to share information, or to build attraction.. it's to elicit positive emotions in the girl! She feels good when she hears that story.. I build it up very dramatically and I describe it to her like she's there watching it happen. it makes her laugh. Eliciting positive emotions is the masterful execution of communication.

Simple conversational abilities can also elicit positive emotions.

One thing I like to do is point out social behavior of those around me to a girl I'm talking to. I remember being at a party once and I was talking to a girl, and I said "You know what I just noticed? Everytime someone drinks from a cup, they always have to look down at the liquid in their cup. I mean, why? It's not like the liquid's going anywhere. You can feel it hit your lips, you don't need to look down at it.. but still, everyone looks. Here, come, let's watch".. and so we went around, secretly watching people socialize with drinks in their hands, and everytime someone took a sip while looking into their cup, her and I would laugh. As we went from room to room, she began clinging to me closer and I returned the kino.. and so on and so on as we escalated playing this stupid "drink watching" game. I was eliciting a sense of CONSPIRACY, as well as a kind of ADVENTURE .. An inside joke is a prime example of a conspiracy. It doesn't matter how you label the response you elicit.. all that you need to focus on is that it's a FUN or PLEASANT emotional response.

How is this last example different from Role-Playing? Well, I used my SOCIAL AWARENESS to bring up the topic.

Social awareness alone is enough to elicit response.

You just vocalize things that you notice in people's behavior.

You can do it to the girl you're talking to "oh my god you talk so fast, are you always like this?".. or "I love the way you say 'yeah", like there's an N in front of it. What is that? Nyeah... .. yeah, see, there you go again! Hah! I love it."

Notice how similar this sounds to negging a girl? It's because it naturally produces negs. By pointing out social behaviors, you are automatically making a girl feel self-conscious about herself. So for those of you that have problems with negs, thinking simply about Social Awareness is a great way to come up with negs ON THE SPOT. You can point out anything, you don't need to think about it being positive or negative. Just point it out and she'll get self-conscious.. this is eliciting a response.. it's not a positive one, though, so it's usually good to finish it off with an SOI like "that's so cute" or "I love that". Remember, the purpose of communication is to elicit POSITIVE emotions.

Notice how this naturally seems to follow the push/pull dynamic of negging with a compliment? Once you understand the psychology of things, it all makes sense.

You can also point out social behaviors in a group. Point out the way people are standing, or who's facing who more.. or who's not participating, or who's the leader. Make sure you follow it with a simple SOI to make sure that you elicit a POSITIVE emotion in the group, like "that's so cool, hah! look at that!" or "I love that, you guys are hilarious." (Example: "Look at us, we're all standing in a circle like a football huddle or something. I guess that would make you the quarterback. Hah! And that group over there must be the other team. Look! They're totally conspiring against us.")

Notice an underlying theme of eliciting positive responses is that of creating a FALSE REALITY. Everyone likes fantasy scenarios. It's why AFC's and PUA's alike engage in "what would you do if you were stranded on an island.." question games.

Another underlying theme is that, by being the source of the positive response, you are in effect, demonstrating leadership qualities.

You can also elicit positive emotions in people when THEY are the ones doing the talking. This is pretty simply done by showing that you appreciate what they have to say, and encouraging them to contribute more. If people like the way you make them feel when they talk to you, they will want to talk to you more. "I love that! I've never thought of that before.. that's so cool. You're like, a fucking genius. I want to have your babies. Our babies will be smart, because of you, and sexy, because of me."

bPUAs totally forget about this very point.. That's why when they learn C+F and Negs, they go around insulting chicks and acting like conceited assholes, and they wonder why it's not working.

Because they aren't eliciting any positive emotions in the girl. So the girl won't want to continue the interaction. She'll look elsewhere, for a guy who will make her FEEL GOOD. Call this "Mr. Goodvibes". You give good vibes no matter what you say.

And this is where the experienced PUA, who understands C+F and Negs are ways to ellicit positive emotions, succeeds.

He'll tell a girl "you look so hot in that dress. But I would totally look hotter in it." And then he'll smile and wink and do a palm read on her and say "oh my god, did you fart?" and when she laughs and denies it he'll smile and say "you are such a bad liar, but that's okay. I like you even though you're gassy..."

So when all is said and done, there are several ways to interact with a girl.. but the true purpose of communication is to ELICIT POSITIVE EMOTIONS.

Some ways to elicit positive emotions:

CONFLICT of Communication and SubC's
UNITY of Communication and SubC's

If Motivational speakers can Elicit a whole audience, then YOU can elicit ANY girl

Demonstrating your Social Awareness

Using Social Awareness to Neg

Encouragement and Appreciation

Be "Mr. Goodvibes" to create C+F and Push/Pull

Be the source of emotions. Elicit POSITIVE Responses. Once you master this, you will be the life of the party everywhere you go.

Game on!
Value is self-perception. Low Value people label themselves in their minds as such. They don't feel deserving, or brave enough, of being the Ultimate, Super-Powered versions of themselves.
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Respected Member

Join Date: 10/04/2008 | Posts: 918

Awesome post.

Why hasn't anyone told me off all of this before?

This way of thinking about communication actually has me excited. :O
Smile. :]
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Senior Member

Join Date: 12/04/2008 | Posts: 150

Good stuff!! thanks for posting it. 8)
“With women, I've got a long bamboo pole with a leather loop on the end. I slip the loop around their necks so they can't get away or come too close. Like catching snakes.” ~Marlon Brando
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Trusted Member

Join Date: 09/27/2006 | Posts: 1022

Pimp of Persia wrote:
This is profound and insightful on so many levels I don't even know where to begin or how to thank you.

Ditto to that, great post
Gunner is great. I'm not sure what he said, but it sounded cool.

real sexting conversations to read
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Trusted Member

Join Date: 01/12/2008 | Posts: 1780

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Trusted Member

Join Date: 01/12/2008 | Posts: 1780

This is some real true shit.
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Respected Member

Join Date: 10/03/2008 | Posts: 816

Hey guys, glad you got something from this.

This is actually an old article of mine from another community board that I dug up. If you didn't catch the Myanmar Cyclone reference, that happened I believe in May of last year, which is around the time that I wrote this.

10 months feels like a decade in terms of game. My perspective on things has flipped and changed and gone through so many evolutions since them, but I figured the insights I had in this article will always be relevant. Although, my "UNITY and CONFLICT" theory of SubC and Communication is something I don't really agree with anymore. As far as that goes, Subcommunication is what I consider to be the main importance nowdays. But if any of you garnered some perspective from that theory then that's cool too.

I may flip through some of my other old write-ups to post. Cheers
Value is self-perception. Low Value people label themselves in their minds as such. They don't feel deserving, or brave enough, of being the Ultimate, Super-Powered versions of themselves.
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Junior Member

Join Date: 08/17/2008 | Posts: 14

This is really great stuff.  It's also really simple if you think about it;  PU tells you to do all these different things and gives you so much to juggle.  It would probably be so much simpler and easier for guys to get laid if all you said was "Have fun for you and make it fun for her."
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Respected Member

Join Date: 11/06/2008 | Posts: 315

Yeah, this was a great post, and I thoroughly appreciate it because I am definitely at the Beginner PUA level where you said there were differing levels of incongruency, and the elicit/communicate paradigm is very enlightening. Really good stuff man, and it helped clear somethings for me
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Charles Ou

Respected Member

Join Date: 04/03/2008 | Posts: 585

Great stuff.

What I would like to add is just that yeah, people mistake the intention of the neg or teasing, it is just to have fun and show you are comfortable in your own skin, and not to insult the girl.

They mistake the frame, but they are using the same words.

Also one last thing is that eliciting some slightly negative emotions is good, like FEAR OF LOSS of you, FEAR of rejection by you.

Acting like a challenge, etc...

But you nailed it. The whole point of an interaction is feeling good and eliciting for the most part: Good emotions.

being light, playfull, not serious, emotional, stupid, not so judgemental, and being happy.
Think OUTSIDE the box.[/]
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Respected Member

Join Date: 08/21/2008 | Posts: 431

Goodness this is such a fucking STELLAR post.

You broke this realm of sub-communication down thoroughly, nicely, concisely and with brevity. I know you could went deeper into it but you definitely layed out the general skeleton.

Serious props for this man. This has shown me why i've been in this dry spell lately, and why some fo my interactions have felt awry.

My trump card has been being able to elicit the right feelings and vibes. Yes..

Keep it up fam, awesome shit.

Sayings remain meaningless until they are embodied in habits...

GOLDEN RULE= Whatever you feel, SHE feels.

"Don't be afraid to go out on a limb; that's where the fruit is."

"Experience is not what happens to a man; it is what a man does with what happens to him."

[='Comic Sans MS']Knowing is not enough, we must apply.
Willing is not enough, WE MUST DO. ~Bruce Lee

What you do in the dark, will come out in the light. Remember that....Peace[/]
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